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Post by camismom on Mar 27, 2004 8:35:47 GMT -5
Morning "guys"! I'm up before everyone else and had a few minutes so I wanted to post this because it's weighing heavily on my mind. We'll be out for the day once everyone else gets up so I'll check back tonight for responses...
Not sure if this should go under "education" but since it happened at school, I'm putting it here.
Cami was involved in a fight with another girl at school yesterday. Y'all have read my post about the problems she and another black friend of hers have had at school with a group of bullies all year long. I almost hate to post this because I don't want to sound racial or prejudice (being in the south and white sticks me in that stereotype) because I sooooo am not, but that in a nutshell is what the problem is, in the opposite way. That and the teacher in the class this happened in.
There are a large group of african-american girls in this class that are forever bullying Cami and her friend in this class. It has been reported several times. I have spoken with the teacher about it, the AP about it, and the AP has spoken to the teacher. This teacher apparently can not control her class. Cami comes home everyday almost with stories that take place in this class. Several months ago, Cami was punched in this class by one of these girls and did not retaliate. I was able to really talk to the AP then, Cami did not get in trouble for it, and I hoped that the problem would stop then. Well, it hadn't. Yesterday while in this class, Cami and her friend were playing with something (an example of what takes place in this class, playing instead of doing what they should be. The class is chorus. Everyone was playing according to Cami). Anyway, something flew off of the thing they were playing with and hit one of these bully girls. She then popped of at Cami, "you better not hit me again!" and threw rice at her (don't ask), Cami threw it back (having had enough of the daily abuse from these girls) and the girl came at her throwing punches (or slaps I should say). Cami, again, having finally had enough of this, came back with punches of her own. She said she felt like it was her only choice. Andy and I have always told her that when backed in a corner, and someone throws the first punch, fight back! This happened in last period so she will be called to office first thing Monday morning, I'm sure.
Here's what I need advice about. Monday being alone and busy, I know I won't be able to talk real well with the AP when she calls. I want to send her an email, but I tend to be a little uglier in those things (it's easier when I'm typing) to get my concerns in about this. I understand punches/slaps were thrown and this is against the rules. I understand whe will face punishment for it (probably ISS), and I have no problem with that. The problem I have is that it happened, period! I want to point out to the AP that this teacher seriously needs to be evaluated because she obviously can't control her class. Why were they playing instead of singing and practicing for the upcoming Spring concert? What was the other girl doing with rice in class? ALL the problems Cami has at school happen in this class. I also want to talk to the AP about the very obvious problem thay have there with prejudice and ask what, if anything, they are doing about it. If this was happening and it was coming from our race, the NAACP would be all up in that school wiht lawsuits of harrassment, etc. Believe me, it has happened before at the high school here. Who do I turn to? In the 6 years my dd spent in the elementary school, she never had problems. All races got along and all was fine. Anyway, my dh thinks I shouldn't do this. I'll be opening up a can of worms in suggesting this teacher can't do her job, and opening up a "racial" issue that is always, unfortunately, a hot topic here. What dop you all think? I want this to stop before she is involved in another fight with another one, or they all jump her one day, and she ends up externally suspended, or hurt. Be honest if you don't agree. I need opinions....
Thanks!
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Post by Linda on Mar 27, 2004 9:01:38 GMT -5
Your post was very good Christy...why don't you e-mail it to the a.p.?You have pointed out every detail and if you open up a can of worms ...oh well...this is your daughter,and it has been going on far to long!
The fact that cami never had any problems in elementary school should say something about her good character to her middle school teachers.I hope it ends soon for her..because in my opinion,cami will continue to fight back out of sheer frustration.A kid can only take so much!
The teacher situation needs to be addressed too...sounds like she REALLY can not control her class!!
This happened to us also in middle school...and Paul finally had enough and knocked the "crap" out of the kid who was bullying him.Hang in there and get back with us.
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Post by rosyred45 on Mar 27, 2004 10:28:16 GMT -5
I can't say for certain, but are there other kids that get into trouble in this class only? If Cami has other friends in this class, call their parents and ask what they think. If they are thinking along the same line, as they say there is power in numbers if you all think this teacher isn't doing the job.
Along the lines of the race thing...I know you said there are obvious racial problems, are they doing anything about it? I don't care what race is what or who is who, but if there is any kind of discrimination whether it be racial, sexual, religious, whatever, it needs to be reported period. Every child is entitled to a safe enviornment that is secure and free of discriminations period.
I'd e-mail the AP after I'd called around about the class. Go in with guns blazing.
This is the problem.....
What are you going to do to fix it?
Let them know how you have bent over backwards to help your daughter only to have something like his happen! It's BS. She is in that class to sing, not play. The other students are there for the same reason. If it turned into study hall instead of chorus, why where you not notified.
OK, AP can come back with:
1. They were getting attendance taken care of.
=so you mean to tell me, the teacher can't control a class of how many while figuring out who is there and who's not there?
2. Why was your daughter fiddling instead of paying attention to the teacher?
=you tell me, the rest of the class was playing too.
3. Doesn't your daughter realize that if she doesn't retaliate, she won't be in as much trouble?
=don't you realize she's being bullied? And I believe that is a national epidemic now. Here father and I agree fighting is not the answer, BUT Cami will not be walked all over, if someone swings on her, she's swinging back.
OK, my, were'd that come from.....hmmmmmm got picked on one too many times.
Kaiti
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Post by Honeysmom on Mar 27, 2004 13:02:49 GMT -5
I agree with Linda, I would send his a copy of what you posted. It is honest, concerned, and not a put down, but real concerns. I have never had this kind of problem (race related) myself, so I probably don't understand it really well, but it does amaze me. I agree, if she is being picked on because she is white, that is wrong. If it were the other way around, that would also be wrong. (as you pointed out) I remember seeing a comedian once who said something about wanting to encourage as much inter-racial marriage as possible, that way in a few hundred years we'd all be a nice shade of grey and then we'd actually dislike someone b/c of them, not the color of their skin. I guess he was sorta right. Good luck, and don't these people know this is not your week to put out fires???  Becky |
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Post by AnneM on Mar 27, 2004 13:18:44 GMT -5
Christy - I am disappointed in the school that they haven't reacted to the bullying in its 'earlier stages' and put a stop to it ... I am just sorry it had to come to this !
The school have been told (you told them) ... the bullying should have been nipped in the bud right away ... but obviously this didn't happen .... It is also clear I agree that the teacher cannot control the class and that there is little learning going on in this particular class! ... I really feel strongly that there is a BIG responsibility here on behalf of the school ...
I also like Linda's idea of sending what you have said to us ... it spells everything out and is clear and concise ... This might have racial connotations because the children involved are of different colours BUT it is in fact a story of bullying ... and the school itself has a responsibility to ensure that this doesn't happen.... (or if it does happen it is dealt with) ...
Oh GOOD LUCK Christy!!
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Post by LitlBaa on Mar 27, 2004 14:00:07 GMT -5
Good for Cami on fighting back! Along with your email to the AP, send it to the principal, dean of students, superintendent, head of the school board, and offer to send a copy to the local newspaper. If the administration can keep things quiet in their school, they usually will. But if things get out, then some action must be taken.
This has been a very successful tactic for me in getting my concerns heard and things taken care of.
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Post by rosyred45 on Mar 27, 2004 16:32:20 GMT -5
I've been mulling over this all day. What I said earlier sounds too nasty. Honest, but nasty. But the bullying thing got to me. In high school, during softball season a few girls picked at me, and picked and picked and picked. Until I blew and told them the next time I had a bat in my hands it wasn't going to hit a ball.
Well, they called me on it so I went and grabbed a bat...
and I was ready to swing. Make sure how Cami feels about everything, she might have it all penned up inside, and if she blows again, it's gonna be known. My mom tried to talk to the people at school, and mom and dad both know that it was pointless. It was our town against theirs. And we always lost, so out with the fists.
You need to take the stand now, rather than give them a chance to walk all over you, because once they start they think they can take you again and again.
Sorry, alittle personal
Kaiti
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Post by camismom on Mar 27, 2004 21:20:43 GMT -5
As I have said so many times before, you guys are the best! It's nice to know you all see my point and are on the "same page" with me. I will copy and paste this post on my email so I won't lose any valuable points. I agree with Kaiti in that Cami has been keeping this all inside for so long, she is going to blow one day, and get hurt, or be the one doing the hurt, but something bad will come of it in the end.
I hope that the mere fact she fought back will teach these girls she has had enough, and make them not look at her as an easy target anymore, and move on. I also hope my "talk" with the AP helps, but if it doesn't, I think I'll take LitlBaa advice and go above her head, as well as getting it in the local news and newspaper.
Thanks again for all the wonderful input. I'll try to check in to the site tomorrow night.
For now, gotta go soak in a bath of oils. I'm red as a lobster from a day on the boat, and boy do I hurt!
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Post by rosyred45 on Mar 28, 2004 19:30:13 GMT -5
Christy, for one, I get burned easy too, soak in a hot tub to pull the burn out, then use LOTS of aloe. Hot tea bags work too.
As with Cami, I just think that you do what you gottta do. What do you feel in your heart of hearts? That's what you need to do.
If you step back and reevaluate and think , OK I see this in a different light. Maybe I'll take another approach, so be it. If you step back and still see red...
Go get em....there is no sense in putting up with this.
Oh I don't know. Hard time with this. I'll help if I can
Kaiti
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Post by camismom on Mar 29, 2004 8:05:11 GMT -5
Kaiti, Thanks for the advice and encouragement. As hard a time as you're having deciding what you would do, is what I'm going through. I have had time to reevaluate, and I'm not seeing as much red, but am still upset that this could happen again if they don't do something. I'm just going to wait for the call from the AP, see what she says and how she acts, and go from there.  As far as the sunburn, I always burn first, then tan. It's already toned down to almost brown today. I soaked in a cool tub that night and put vinegar on the more hot spots to pull the burn out. Old trick of my mom's. Take care y'all. I'll let you know what happens today... |
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Post by rosyred45 on Mar 29, 2004 9:16:55 GMT -5
Good luck with it. Hopefully things will work out for the best.
Kaiti
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Post by finnmom on Mar 29, 2004 10:01:53 GMT -5
Camismom I know I´am terribly late, but still. I think you´ve got so many good advice´s to follow, so I have nothing to add. Only GO FOR IT!! you can treadh them about going public, before actually doing it, so you´ll propably get it done much easier. Noone want´s their bisness get public ;D Sunburn; AUTCH ;D I have had my share of those, I´ve to try vinegar next time, I havent even thought about it  take care! Marja |
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Post by camismom on Mar 29, 2004 15:42:38 GMT -5
Well, if I wasn't upset before I am now. Cami got 3 days out of school suspension. My coworker is on vacation, my mom is only a few days fresh out of the hospital, I can't take off, what am I supposed to do with my kid? This is her first offense, first time in any major trouble, she didn't throw the first punch, yet she gets three days out of school!  AARRGGHH!! "We have a zero tolerance for fighting here" "There's no room for this type behavior", blah, blah, blah! All the other points I made seemed to have been taken with a grain of salt. "We will look into that", "We always reflect back on a situation after the fact to see what could've been done to avoid this, or what can be done to keep it from happening again", blah, blah, blah! I told her I understand that fighting is wrong, but the other girl threw the first punch. What was she supposed to do, stand there and take the beating? She has already taken a punching from another girl in this same class a few months back. GGGGGGGrrrrrrrrrrrrr, I am mad. There is no justice, rhyme or reason in these schools today!! |
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Post by rosyred45 on Mar 29, 2004 15:55:07 GMT -5
I'm so sorry you have to go through this right now. I'll be praying for you. Not really much else I can do to help. BTW, I can't stand blanketed Zero Tolerance rules. Their all designed to be good, but when they are carried out, someone always gets the short end of the stick. Kaiti  |
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Post by camismom on Mar 30, 2004 8:26:53 GMT -5
I am really at my wit's end about this. I found out and Cami admitted it as well, that she made an off the cuff, impulsive remark about "wishing she could hit that girl" before it all happened, but she insists that the bump into the girl that supposedly started it all was an accident. She said she made the remark because the girl was "getting on her nerves", but didn't really mean it, it was just irony that all this crap happened shortly after. Now, don't get me wrong, I don't find Cami completely faultless here, and I know she is not perfect, but I have never had trouble with her lieing to me before, never. I have trouble with her mouthiness, backtalking, laziness, slobbiness, not doing things when asked, etc. ;D, but never lieing, so I am inclined to believe this. I did find out however that the teacher is lied. When I made a comment to the AP aboutwondering why the kids were playing in class with this bowl and rice in the first place, the AP said she had thought the same, but that the teacher told her all this began at the beginning of the class when the "kids were coming in and getting settled." The class starts at 2:10 and ends at 3:20. Cami said that was not true, that class had been going a while, that they had been doing a worksheet and everyone had finished it and had nothing to do, that's why they were playing. She said Ms. W was sitting right behind her at her desk when this all happened. She said the class was about halfway over when it happened. That would put the time at about 2:45. She said that afterwards the teacher selected another student to send to another class to get two referrals and then complete them when the student returned with them. I figured that would have taken about ten to fifteen minutes. Well, lo and behold I noticed the "time of the incident" she put on the referral slip was 3:00. That kind of coincides with Cami's story, don't you think. Seems to me she was trying to cover her butt for letting the kids play and not catching all this stuff before it escalated into the actual punches being thrown. Grrrrr! I find blame in Cami, and I find blame in the other girl, but I guess I find the most blame in the teacher for not paying enough attention to her class to notice 1. Cami "bumping the girl" and making her mad. 2. The girl popping off at Cami as a result of the bump. 3. The firl then gathering a handful of rice to throw it at Cami. 4. Cami then gathering the scattered rice up to throw back at the girl. All this before the first punch yet the teacher never noticed.
Oh well, what is done is done. She is with my mom for the next three days and y'all may disagree with me, not in any trouble from us. This girl has been bullying her all year, and she finally had enough and fought back. Maybe now the girl will leaver her alone.
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