What women earn

[Linda]

Take two girls from suburban Smyrna, Georgia. One grows up to become America's favorite actress, pulling down a cool $20 million per film with plenty of free time to chill out on her ranch. The other, on moving to Smyrna, finds a career as a fast-food restaurant manager, working 55 hours a week, all for $29,000 a year. As Smyrna girls Julia Roberts and Evelyn Hernandez could tell you, such is the hard-earned, wide-ranging, and not always equitable paycheck of the American woman.




The $20 million woman:
Julia Roberts.

As everyone knows, more women than ever are employed in the workplace, despite a slight downturn in the number of new moms immediately returning to work in the last two years. And women's paychecks have risen accordingly: Between 1979 and 2000, salaries for white women grew at about 22.9 percent (adjusted for inflation), reports the U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics. However, women of color fared far worse: Earnings in the same period grew just 14.7 percent for African-American women, and just 4.6 percent for Hispanic women. Add it all up, and the average American woman working full time makes $491 a week ($303 if she doesn't have a high-school diploma, and $760 if she has a college degree).

We don't pocket all of those earnings, of course. Taxes take a bite, and Social Security accounts for a 6.2 percent chunk, of which an average of $756 per month is doled out to women when they reach retirement age. Of all working women, 27.9 million have health insurance through their employer, which takes an average of $4,430 a year from their salaries. Wisely, many of us put a portion of our wages toward the future; a typical woman's IRA is valued at $26,307, and for defined-contribution plans, such as a 401(k), a woman's accounts have an accumulated average value of $25,020.

But what puzzles economists is that women are still making considerably less -- about 76 cents on the dollar -- than men. While we're pretty much equal in income when we begin our careers, the gap between men's and women's salaries gets bigger as time goes on. "It's not until men and women get into their 30s and 40s that the wage gap exists," says Jay Meisenheimer, an economist with the Bureau of Labor Statistics. The discrepancy exists across the board -- even in professional fields like medicine, law, and management.

• Bureau of Labor Statistics >>

Why, in this presumably liberated age, do women continue to earn less? Part of it has to do with the jobs we choose: "Men are still more likely to be in fields like electrical engineering, and women are still more likely to be teachers," says Meisenheimer. Another reason: In their 20s and 30s -- the peak years for accumulating valuable work experience and the paychecks to match -- many women take short- or long-term leaves from work to raise their children, making it harder for them to catch up monetarily when they return to the office. Indeed, family is a huge factor: According to the Bureau of Labor Statistics, the gender pay gap in 2000 was widest among parents, with mothers earning just two-thirds of the income of fathers.

And yet not all of us are angrily hammering at the glass ceiling, demanding justice. "Women see the work and family thing differently -- they are more interested in flexibility than money," says Marie C. Wilson, president of the Ms. Foundation for Women. Polls consistently show that women would take a lower-paying job that offered them more free time.

The rise in female entrepreneurship certainly seems to show that women aren't always in the job for the money. Currently, there are 6.2 million women business owners, reports the Center for Women's Business Research, a Washington, D.C.-based research organization. And, according to a Center poll, women don't start their own businesses in hopes of getting rich; the majority say they simply had a great idea and wanted to make it happen.

• Center for Women's Business Research >>

[finnmom]

Oh, so it´s international problem, not just us No kidding, I knew that already. It happend´s in here too, mayby not such big figure´s but job´s concidered as women´s job´s do get payed less than more manly job´s.

I expecially hate the fact that I shared 3 and half year of college with engineer-student´s, we had lot of common glasses and all but our salarie´s are totally different story. Nearly craduated engineer get´s almost immediately almost double time as much as I get.

I dont know.... how to change that... we need more men doing the traditional "female-job´s" and vice versa ;D Just waiting for that to happend ;D ;D

[Linda]

marja... how many men do you think could do traditional "women's work"? Don't get mad guys ;D ;D

[mothercat]

This is a hard subject for those of us who can and do work as hard as men and can work beside and keep up with men. I have had two men tell me that when gramma passes and I go back to work ( as if I dont do anything nowbut sit and knit) that they will hire me on as part of their work crew. I wont get paid as much but I would be more reliable, harder working , and easier to look at than most of their crew. While when I landscape being a women it is called puttering..but if it were a man it is called professional gardener.

I am totally against the "I am women hear me roar " bit because I think if you have to spout the difference then you aren't equal to start with. BUT the pay should be on the same level for the same job, experience, and educational background. There are alot of male actors who make alot less than Julia Roberts but the MS Foundation doesn't mention that part. There are also alot of men who would love to stay home and raise the kids but in todays society they are called lazy bums for feeling that way. It is a two way street because we have divided it for too long between the two sexes.
Maybe if we stopped spouting all our differences then maybe they would stop saying but you are different. Thats the only thing I dont like about foundations like MS Foundation. They draw more bad attention than good.

Most jobs that are considered womens work were traditionally male jobs in the beginning.. butlers ran the household, waiters waited tables, male chefs cooked, I think the only job we as women can really take credit for is the most important..child birthing..and rearing .Gee I wander how the pay scale would work on those two jobs if it were reversed..( I'd bet they would expect more than "good job honey!" and" I love you!" ;D)

[AnneM]

I am convinced it all comes down to the fact that "women have babies" .... I don't like the reason but I honestly believe that EVEN TODAY men get the pick of the jobs because when a woman under 35 goes for an interview she will either already HAVE children which can potentially disrupt her working day OR she will be very possibly having babies in the near future ... in which case she will need to leave the company for a few months etc. very possibly to be followed by Baby No 2, possibly No. 3 and so on..... & many of whom do NOT return to the workplace afterwards ....

Much as i "OBJECT" to this reasoning , I have to admit that if I were a potential employer I could very well end up thinking along these same lines!!

[mskris]

I have to admit that I'm the oddity here...I make nearly twice what my dh makes. That's mainly because of our fields, though. I work in pharmaceuticals, he works in architecture.

That said, though, I must tell you that men hired to do the same job as I at the same level with LESS experience make more than I do. Also, some are hired at levels above me with LESS EXPERIENCE, which is really galling. However, like the article said, I'm much more interested in flexibility (I work 2 days at home) and time off than I am in money. I make a good salary, and the benefits are great. I'll keep it and pretty much keep my mouth shut.

BTW, though, I DID NOT feel this way until I had kids. Prior to having my family, I was very ambitious. I have to squelch most of my natural ambition to focus on my family (not that I mind). It does p*ss me off when a newbie comes along and is hired at higher level and better pay, though. Especially when they then ask me to TRAIN him!!

Kris

[camismom]

Well, I guess I can't complain here. I am one of three computer operators. We have three shifts and I'm the first shift one. Anyway, I started this job AFTER the other two who are male. I make more than both, but it is because I have been with the school district itself longer than they have.

I know this is a common problem though and I too don't think it is right!

Anne, you know there were a few times in my younger years when the subject you mentioned was actually brought up in interviews. "Do you have any children?" or "are you planning to?" I then found out it was illegal to ask that question in an interview and pointe it out to the potential employer next time I was asked it.

[milesofsmiles]

I feel like I am a member of the "Can't we all just get along" crowd. If everything was fair, we would not be paying athletes $20 million to swing a bat or run on a field kicking a ball. I do feel that we idolize those people and the pay is out of control. I agree that I can't do what they do, but could they do what we do (the common folks)?

It would be a lot easier if every man/woman got paid the same for the same type of work. It would be nice if green people got paid the same as purple people. It is unfortunate that our lives on this earth are not built on total fairness, that is reserved for after life. But I do the best I can with the talents I have and help as many people as I can in the process.

I once was asked if I was planning to have children during an interview. I told them with a smile, that I was not aware that males were capable of giving birth. They got the point.

I know that there are not a lot of men in the nursing field, what are some other fields considered to be a womans profession?

Miles

[DANIEL]

a guys point of view, i will be the first to admit i am diffrent from alots of guys...very diffrent. ask my wife, ask my friends wives, i have problems with men, (not so much now that i have medication) i think most men are too agressive, i think most men think with the wrong part of their anatomy, i could go on for a long time about all the things i dont like about men, but i just dont see the inequity in the work force, at least not in the mens favor. women get to take time off to have kids, men do not get anytime off when they have kids. when my daughter was born i was working two jobs and i hardly ever got to see her or my wife, and i couldnt take time off, ( please dont missconstrue this as saying women dont need the time off) so thats one advantage, then there is affermative action well thats just not right, it says that if because of your gender and race you are better than others, dont get me wrong, i am not dumb enough to think that in certain areas of the nation there arent hiring prefrences, but to penalize some one because of something they cant do anything about is wrong( like gender and race) , and if people didnt think that was wrong then affirmative action would be there in the first place ( to set people of a certain gender and race above others). i have been "let go" from a job because of my gender and race. the place where i worked had to comply with the quotas and i was "let go" to make room to do that. when i was younger i wanted to start my own radio station, i was told i could not do it cause i wasnt a woman that fcc would not grant me the license,
it dosent help me that i have add, moms with add kids out there you know that your kids have problems with emotions sometimes, and a lot of the time they feel that people dont like them, or that they are being singled out so i may be just affected by that, but that dosent chane the way i percieve things. when i was in college, we had special days honoring every race creed gender sexual oreintation and what not, people would line the halls with booths and pictures proclaiming how special it was to be them, when you complain about it, you get the joy of hearing how the straight white man has been in power since the dawn of time and how he has oppressed all other minorities, and i dont deny that it happened, but i didnt do it and i will make sure my kids dont do it. when i hire people i hire people that need jobs, its just like i keep telling everyone around here i hate everyone, i can garuntee that i hold everyone on the planet with equal disdane, individuals are ok, i just dont like people. i am a computer tech i think thats a healthy outlook. i just feel attacked and penalized, for something i can do nothing about. there is a lot of unjust things in this world and i hate that that is the case and i hate to have to sit back and say i cannot change the world, that i cannot do anything about it, the only way i make it is by not thinking about it. it just strikes a nerve with me because i have been kick down so many times for being a man. a good example would be when me and my wife had a misscarrage, we were both devastated, would you believe that i was told that it didnt happen to me and i could understand what my wife was going through. by a female nurse. i cant begin to you what that does to a person, your already greiving and someone tells you that your pain is not important. me and michelle wanted to know why it had happened, and so i asked the doctor if she knew why her body aborted the pregnancy. talk about a *&$@ the doctor had the nerve to berate me for using the "abort" word in front of my wife and that if i was a woman i would understand. one of the few times in my life i was too stunned to say something, it blew my wife away.
maybe its just me, i dont know maybe i am just too sensitive, a lot of guys would agree to that. anyway i dont think that women in general are treated unfairly in the workplace, keeping in mind i said in general. if a woman had applied for this job the same time i did she would have goten it, hands down, because she was a girl, and for no other reason. ok going to get off my bitter soap box, i have probably offended some people here i am sorry if i did
daniel

[mskris]

Daniel - I agree with much of what you wrote. FYI - men can take family/medical leave (unpaid), too. Also, in some companies now, men can take paternity leave, and not only for biological babies, but adopted ones, too.

I am not convinced that the discrimination for gender still exists, but it did not too long ago. I was appalled when a guy was hired at my level to do the same work at what I KNOW was quite a higher salary. I ended up training him.

But I don't complain about my situation - like I said, I am well compensated both monetarily and with benefits, so I am content. All I ask is respect for my brains, without regard to my sex.

Kris

[AnneM]

This is interesting ... in fact strangely in the UK right now there is a law being passed which will grant fathers "paternity" leave when their wives have kids ... I understand this will be around 3 months + off work ...

I am not certain I agree with this however!! ... If my dh had taken three months off work when Sam was first born I think I personally would have gone CRAZY !! ;D

[finnmom]

I have to come back... In Finland father can have 3 week´s paternity-leave when they have a child(they get the same amount to compensate the payroll as women do at their maternity-leave) then we have the part of parental-leave, I think it´s around 3-4 month´s, that can be used eather by mom or dad. O´kay, most mo´s use it. but father´s have the chance too.

Finland is quite famous of being very equal nation, women got their right to vote at the very beginning of 1900, but still I think that women´s salarie´s could be higher

[camismom]

Daniel I agree with a quite a bit of what you said and commend you for being brave enough to say it!! No offense taken at all.