About ADHD and Tourettes and Compulsive disorders

[pamela123]

Hello every-one my name is Pamela Isidori.
I have actually been on this site for quiet a while.
I guess I just like to read about what every-one is going through(all the same as I am going through)

I have a question for you?Does any-one have children who have compulsive,ADHD plus Tourettes.
My son just turned 5 in Jan.
He has had compulsive disorder since the day he could talk.
Every-thing had to be done a certain way.He can not even have his clothes touching his neck.Open collar(I guess that's what you call it)If it touches his neck I have to or he does tries stretching it out til it no longer touches his neck.
He has nervous Ticks.Major major ticks.Usually he has it because he's tired or scared or excited.
A lot of different twitches he does.Now he starts twitching his neck.Just started that last month.
Active,very very active.Can not sit still.Always on the go.
In kindergarten he get's time-out 1-4 times a day.
Last year he went to see his peditrician and he said it could be all 3 things that he has.he said he's still too young to really be diagnoised.
Is any-one going through what I am?
Thanks and I will be back on line tonight some time.
Thanks so much.
Pamela Isidori

[Allanque]

With the shirt thing, I'd ask about Sensory Integration problems. There's a thread on it in this forum a bit down.

[pamela123]

Thanks Allanque for your help.

So how are you doing?I remember you from the other ADHD site.

You have ADD or ADHD?
I found out that I too have ADD.

That's probably why my son has ADHD.

Since I was a little girl I had major major problems in school.Not only would kids tease me calling me stupid and dum.
I just could not understand school.
I would daydream alllll day.Fall asleep in class(especially when they would close the lights to watch a movie)then I'd be sleeping.
I could study and study and then blank right out when it was time to do the test.
Truthfully I'm so happy to be out of school.
Kids are so mean and cruel.
I guess they still are?
Take care and thanks.
Pamela

[counting2ten]

Hi Pamela

My son has severe ADHD, Tourette's and pediatric bipolar disorder. Usually a child is diagnosed first with ADHD and a Tourette diagnosis may happen around 7 or 8. The reason for this is that the two disorders mimic each other a great deal. Tourette's is not just what society thinks of it as i.e. swearing, body jerking etc. although this can be the case. The tics have to be fairly regular and repetitive. Sometimes it takes me a day before I know C has a true tic. They can be motor tics or vocal tics like grunting, clearing throat etc. Tourette's seems to encompass alot of ADHD like characteristics i.e anger management is nil, frustration level very high, explosive temper. C can also get so focused on things that it seems like he is on a mission. Social skills can seem very far behind others and often a lack of empathy towards people.

If you read some information about both disorders it is very easy to pick things out of both that totally will describe your child. He might not fit into either completely but will show signs of both. This is called a co-morbid condition. Obsessiveness can also be there but maybe not enough of it to call it obsessive-compulsive disorder. Very confusing I know. My son had to be admitted to the hospital for a six week residential program at the age of 7 in order for the specialists to figure everything out. I was thankful at the end of it only because it gave me some direction and I now know how to deal with it. Not always mind you but I understand the rages, meltdowns and other quirks and can deal with them productively.

C is now 10 and isn't getting 'better' but just changing over the years and we speak openly about how he is different from others his age and what words he can use to describe himself to his friends so he won't be shunned.

Sorry this was so long. Message me if you would like some more information.

[pamela123]

Thanks so much for replying to my post.
trust me,I don't mind when people write long or short messages.
All or little info is good for me.

Yes I know exactly what you are going through?
It's not easy.But we will all make it.

For me it's so hard.He's still too young to be diagnoised.

But we know for sure it's ADHD(only because I have ADD)
He's very very very hyper too(since he was a baby)
Major major ticks.Especially when he's tired or excited or especialllllyy NERVOUS.
But Tourettes we are not sure about.I think we probably wont know til he's much older(for Tourettes)

But he starts twitching his head now with shoulder shrug too.But he did that for like 2 weeks (non stop)now we don't see the shoulder shrugs or head twitching.
In less the older he gets,the more he gets.
But he does a lot of grunting and motor ticks.
Right now we have him on herbal meds from this site.
It works so well.My mother bought the
Natural Remedy(called FOCUS)
I just put 5 drops 2 times a day in his juice and it has really calmed his whinning down.

He used to whinne non stop.Especially when it was bed time.He always had to complain about it or any-thing.
Now he's so much better.But he's still active.
At least I controlled the whinning part(for now)
He's been on it for a month so far(I recommend it to any-one)it's so awesome and very cheap.
Well have to go.
It's like 1:30am here.
Need sleep.
Thanks for answering my post.
Pamela

[dansmommy]

Hi Pamela -- My ds is eight and has diagnoses of Tourette's and ADHD, but he's definitely gone through those OCD phases -- like right after he turned five and he was washing his hands every few minutes, couldn't go to the park, couldn't sit through dinner without getting up to wash his hands.
My ds is doing "okay" in school, but we've been having a thing lately where he's interrupting the teacher and she's been correcting him. I would be worried about your ds's teacher timing him out so much -- four time-outs of five minutes each is 20 minutes a day. My ds went to kindergarten for only 2 1/2 hours a day, and that would have been a big chunk of his time. What's she timing him out for? Are the things she's doing it for within his control? You may need an educational plan -- a 504 or an IEP. I would discourage any time-outs for behavior other than physical aggressiveness, and even then, he probably needs an aide if he's having that much trouble. So many things can be just IGNORED, and especially in kindergarten. Hope you don't mind my ranting and raving -- interrupting everything to time him out disrupts the class more than his behaviors most likely. Also it may well increase the behaviors by paying too much attention to them. Is it possible he's getting timed out for tics? Maybe now I'm done. Here's a great website that says it all a lot better than I can:
www.tourettesyndrome.net/ Christie

[pamela123]

Hello dansmommy actually the reason he gets time-out is because of him talking when she's talking.

My son never stops talking.He just goes on and on.

But I told her (actually his first week of school)about the ticks he has.
I said if please nottt to give him time-out when he makes noises.
He does a lot of humming,grunting and clearing throat.
plus some-times he will stick his tongue out and make noises(a new tick)so I told her that if you see him stick his tongue out,he's not trying to be rude.I told her it's a new tick.
She's very good about it.Plus I asked her if she could make sure children don't make fun of him.Just to keep her eye on him. My son already(at age5)get's upset that he can't stop making noises.some-times my family does my poor son to stop making noises and to sit still.
But he says he can't help it.I feel so bad for him.
I guess a lot of people don't really understand until they too experience it.

Some-times my son when he gets time-out it's because(I can not believe he does this)he puts a plastic bag over his head.
I keep telling him not to do that.He thinks it's funny.
It really scares me.


Hope you don't mind my ranting and raving.

No don't worry.I don't mind.The more advice the better.
But I will definately keep my eye on the time-outs and make sure it's not because of Ticks.

Thanks for the web-site.I will go check it out now.
thank-you.Have a great week-end.
Pamela

[counting2ten]

dansmommy

Thank you a million times over for the website. What a find! It describes to a 't' the rages my son has battled since he was four. He has severe ADHD, Tourette disorder and pediatric bipolar disorder. He is now almost 11 and has at least one per week despite the meds/support/coaching etc. he gets. He can't explain what sets him off and is an absolute little terror for the duration of them and afterwards hides in or under something until he is calm and willing to talk. Usually he just continues on as if nothing has happened. It is nice to know that it is recognized as a disorder and that there are others out there that also deal with this.

Thank you again for this very helpful link.

[dansmommy]

Glad you liked it, counting2ten. What did people do before the Internet? Christie

[mskris]

Hi, Pamela:

Actually, Dansmommy and I have a lot in common. My ds is also 8 yo and has ADHD/TS. The TS is VERY mild - in fact, if dh didn't have it, one might not notice ds' at all. But, since dh has it, we were on the lookout.

The TSNowWhat site is good. You'll find there though, that the explosive temper, anger control issues, and similar manifestations are NOT diagnostic of TS (they're more likely the adhd or the bipolar that coutning2ten mentioned). Also, tics generally start between the ages of 2 and 12, with school age (6-8) being most common.

TS can involve simple or complex motor and vocal tics. Both motor and vocal tics must be present to diagnose as TS. My ds has eye-blinking, throat-clearing, sniffling, occasional grimacing (nose-wrinkling), lip-licking, and lately, he turns his head as if looking over his right shoulder. Dh has more and they're more noticeable (jerking his right arm straight out is one). Neither has copralalia (swearing), which really only about 10% of TS patients have, even though that's what most people think of when they think of TS.

Tics wax and wane and anxiety or excitement can exacerbate them. TS is not progressive - ie, it won't worsen over time, but there may be periods of increased ticcing and the tics can change over time. Eye blinking was ds' first one and he was only 4 - it really wasn't a big deal. He had the most tics last school year from March - June because he was under enormous stress from bullying at school and was even experiencing anxiety attacks during that time. There is an element of compulsion to the tics sometimes (eg, dh said sometimes he's compelled to repeat the tic 3 times) and that makes substitution difficult (eg, if they try to perform a different action, it doesn't release the stress the same way as performing the actual tic). Most people gain some control over their tics as they age, at least in public. Dh now can suppress the tics in public, but releases them later at home...

Hope that helps some. We're lucky that ds' TS symptoms are so mild. We focus much more on the ADHD....

As for what you describe as compulsions, it sounds more like sensory integration disorder, or just plain hypersensitivity, which my ds doesn't have, but I know many adhd kids do.

Good luck and feel free to ask any more you like. Another good website is Tourettesyndromeplus.com - there's a great advocacy section within that site.

Kris