ODD?

[Dad2Brooke]

How, exactly, does ODD manifest itself.

Brooke will not take no for an answer. My wife and I back each other up. If one says no, the other does too. Rarely have we ever torpedoed the other one, but it has happened. But Brooke will go from one to the other even though she knows the answer will be no and we tell her not to.

Sometimes we will tell her no, and then right in front of us she proceeds to do it anyway. Of course we stop her, but the point is that she would have done it right in front of us despite telling her no.

Additionally, it always a struggle to get her to do anything she doesn't want to do. It usually take a fair amount of yelling to get her to do something. That is not how I want my daughter to remember her childhood. "Mommy and daddy yelled at me alot when I was a child."

So, is this just typical of normal childhood, ADHD or could it be ODD, and how do I have her tested for ODD?

[catseye]

Brooke will not take no for an answer. My wife and I back each other up. If one says no, the other does too. Rarely have we ever torpedoed the other one, but it has happened. But Brooke will go from one to the other even though she knows the answer will be no and we tell her not to.

Sometimes we will tell her no, and then right in front of us she proceeds to do it anyway. Of course we stop her, but the point is that she would have done it right in front of us despite telling her no.

I am right there with you!!! This gets my goat everytime, and I do not have a clue how to get sd8 to stop doing this... Heck we can both say no at the same time, and sd tries to manipulate one or both of by saying "but daddy said".... GRRRRR I just heard daddy say the same thing I did!!

We also are the typical "yelling" family and I hate it!! The stress is so bad I sometimes stay at work longer than necessary just to stay away from my home... It seems to be a battle zone...

Sd has not been dx persay with odd, but I have a strong feeling she has it... Although we are waiting to see if the hearing aids (maybe she doesnt actually hear us??) will help some of this behavior... We are going to the psychologist tomorrow, and I will be waving my white flag saying help me I give up!! Sorry I am not much help but I will be watching this thread like a hawk!!!

cat

[Dad2Brooke]

catseye said:

Although we are waiting to see if the hearing aids (maybe she doesnt actually hear us??) will help some of this behavior...

cat

Not to make light of your situation, because I am not trying to do that...

But my daughter has what I like to call selective hearing. The same child that can hear the ice cream truck from a mile away, can't hear me say "bedtime" from the other end of the sofa.

[foley]

Dad to Brooke,

How old is you dd? Usually you won't get a dx of ODD until a child is 12. ODD is an awful dx because it cannot be treated with meds and there have been very success stories.

My DS is classic ADHD with ODD. ODD is basically you say white, he says black. These children are very contrary,and rather than breaking something because the can't control their impulses, they break it on purpose, they're vindictive. The biggest indication of ODD is they have a problem with all the authority figures in their life, parents, teachers, coaches.

We've been very successful using Omega Fatty Acid Supplements, and the Feingold Elimination Program. My DS's ADHD improved with the Feingold Program, but his ODD pretty much dissipated after correcting his Fatty Acid deficiency.

Here's a link in case you're interested--

borntoexplore.org/omega.htm

HTH
Foley

[catseye]

ODD is basically you say white, he says black.

Not quite the same but there are days that I swear I could tell sd8 to breathe, and to defy me she would stop breathing!!! I havent tried it yet though!! LOL ;D

cat

[StrugglingAgain]

My son was with our child psychiatrist yesterday afternoon. He is going to try to smooth his ODD out with taking Risperdal for a short period of time. My son is aggressive towards everyone and NEVER, EVER does what I say. He backtalks till I'm ready to throttle him, and along with all his defiance, it's about to do me in. He's eight. The doctor said that if we continue the behavior mods (that we've already done for four straight years), ONE of these days the lightbulb will come on. HE PROMISED!! I hate it that he's taking FOUR different types of meds, but what's a mother to do?

[Honeysmom]

ODD also has other charestricts too. Lying is a big one, and Lying about things that you, and they know are not true. Placing blame on everyone else, and placing false blame on other people for their actions. Honey will defy me just for the dake of defying me. It is extremely frusterating! He is much younger than Folye's son, he is only 4, and this is extemely young to be dx with this, but he has seen 4 differnt doc's in differnt clinics and differnt parts of the state and they all come up with the same thing. We also do the Omega Fatty Acids and they do help. Good Luck...Becky

[Marichu]

???My son,Adrian,8 trs.old was diagnosed to have AD/HD almost 3 months ago.I'm confused if he has related disorder of ODD.When he was yet undiagnosed and younger until last year at age 7,he couldn't take NO for an answer and threw tantrums anywhere.But I decided to be consistent with my telling him No.I didn't give-in no matter how much he cried,shouted and went into rage.But what concerns me at present is his behavior in school.When provoked by the slightest teasings,other kid's starings and noisy classmates,he would become fierce and hits or wrestles with them.He gets into trouble outside the classroom too.Now,I'm scouting for another school with smaller population and with TLC teachers.The school authorities couldn't understand him even with the knowledge that he has AD/HD.But he doesn't display such rage at home.He has only 1 brother aged 14.How would you explain this situation in school?

[Dad2Brooke]

Guest-foley said:

Dad to Brooke,

How old is you dd? Usually you won't get a dx of ODD until a child is 12. ODD is an awful dx because it cannot be treated with meds and there have been very success stories.

My DS is classic ADHD with ODD. ODD is basically you say white, he says black. These children are very contrary,and rather than breaking something because the can't control their impulses, they break it on purpose, they're vindictive. The biggest indication of ODD is they have a problem with all the authority figures in their life, parents, teachers, coaches.

We've been very successful using Omega Fatty Acid Supplements, and the Feingold Elimination Program. My DS's ADHD improved with the Feingold Program, but his ODD pretty much dissipated after correcting his Fatty Acid deficiency.

Here's a link in case you're interested--

borntoexplore.org/omega.htm

HTH
Foley

Brooke just turned 7. I have noticed that she doesn't like to be told no. Usually, there are words about it, but we usually mange to get her to do it. So far I have not seen her break anything intentionally.

I have noticed that when she gets in trouble it is anyones fault but her own. She rarely owns up for her actions.

I will look into the fatty acids. Thanks for the info.

[milesofsmiles]

Our little Nater, 6 , I am convinced that he was ODD since before he was born. In the delivery room he refused to be born and had to be pulled into the world. It has been a daily struggle with his behavior ever since. Don't get me wrong, he definately has his good moments, but the bad..... He has been diagnosed ADD (little HD) and ODD for about 6 months. His ODD manifests itself as selective hearing to get attention, verbal black and white arguments, some throwing, hitting, swearing, ignoring. There are a lot of "No!!"'s from him. He does this with people he has grown close to. I have seen a pattern where he will reel a new person in with his sweet side, then consistantly 6 weeks later, he will start to push the limits of dicipline.

There are times that he wants to initiate a salt/pepper arguement. I was sucked in a lot of times, but have found a way around these. It goes something like this.... He askes a question to me, my answer is say pepper, he says no way salt. So I ask him to repeat the question, and I say oh, the answer must be salt. I keep switching back and forth until he gets tired of his game. At least we are not yelling at each other by the end. The trick is when to realize when he really is seeking your opinion and when he just wants to get a rise out of you.

IMO,

Miles

[foley]

You're welcome Ralph. My DS also presents those symptoms too. Catatonic posted this excellent ADHD & Treatments/Causes Article in another forum. It's well worth the read and talks about the different ways that ADHD presents itself--personally I don't believe in the ODD dx--I think it's ADHD presenting itself in that manner--

Here's the link--

www.thorne.com/pdf/journal/55/attention_deficit.pdf

Best,
Foley

[Dad2Brooke]

foley said:

Here's the link--

www.thorne.com/pdf/journal/55/attention_deficit.pdf

Best,
Foley

Thanks, I checked out the link but it doesn't work.
Can you resend it?

[foley]

Sorry about that!


Let me try again--

www.thorne.com/pdf/journal/5-5/attention_deficit.pdf



Here's another link too--

www.mdheal.org/attention.htm


~*

[Dad2Brooke]

Got it...

Thanks, I have some reading to do.

[Amsmom]

Below is the link to an American Academy of Child and Adolescent Psychiatry journal article on ODD:

www.aacap.org/publications/factsfam/72.htm

My son, now 7, was dx ODD at 3. Good luck all, we need all we can get!!!!