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Post by franksmom on Sept 22, 2004 13:55:51 GMT -5
I know this may sound a little strange but I was wondering...
I really feel like I would rather work on my sons ADHD drug -free BUT I am having some trouble with the ODD.
My son also seems to have a real problem with self esteem- he is totally destroyed if kids at school make nasty comments. It destroys his entire day! Then he becomes more defiant and totally distrespectful towards other kids and even authority.
Now my question is this...is it possible (from your experience ) to just use meds to help with the ODD? If so what meds do they usually use to treat ODD?
I hope my little blurb made sense.
Thee ODD part of this is really making me nuts- especially since my DH thinks that the only reason he behaves this way is because mommy didnt disipline him enough and make him have more respect!
Any ideas would be so appreciated.
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Post by AnneM on Sept 22, 2004 14:11:32 GMT -5
Hi Franksmom ...  You are making a lot of sense to me ... I have always felt that the "comorbids" that so often go along with adhd are more troublesome than the adhd/add itself! .. In my son's case it was depression which caused more problems when it was present than his add has done! ... I definitely hear you when you say you would primarily like to attack the ODD ... However I am not certain what meds are used for ODD ... hopefully others can be more helpful in that ... but I HAVE been led to understand that if ODD is present the stimulants CAN (although not always) actually make the ODD worse (even though they are good for treating the ADHD/ADD!) ... but if ODD is of prime concern then I understand you are right in being cautious about the stimulants... GOOD LUCK !! |
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Post by catseye on Sept 22, 2004 14:11:47 GMT -5
To be honest, my sd has not been actually diagnosed ODD BUT I see signs of its symptoms when my sd is not on her adhd medication of adderall xr 30 mg....
The school gave us a report on my sd unmedicated that shows many defiance problems, self esteem issues, baby talk (immaturity) etc....
Since she has been back on her medication they see nothing but positive changes... One sentence says "she has not been oppositional when asked to do a task, or stop doing an inappropriate behavior"... That sentence is leading me to believe that sd does have some odd, and that the adderall xr 30 mg is helping her with it...
Reminder sd isnt diagnosed with it specifically, just thought maybe this would help... Good luck
cat
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lisle
Full Member
Posts: 142
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Post by lisle on Sept 22, 2004 14:56:10 GMT -5
I understand some dr. use very low dose risperdal/other atypicals for this. They have risks if you use them low dose though. Diabetes and weight gain are problematic. I don't think there are any drugs out there "actually" for odd.
lisle
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Post by franksmom on Sept 22, 2004 15:12:30 GMT -5
Catseye: My son has not been formally diagnosed either , but if he doesn't have it nobody does! We used to use the AdderallXR (for almost 3 years) but I noticed he was much more tempermental,moody,tearful..everything! Thats why I stopped it. He hardly ate and hardly slept. It must have been the ODD being exacerbated by the stimulants. Are there specific behavior mods. that have been found to work well with these kids. Time outs dont work, 123 doesnt work -he turns and runs the other way and I dont want to chase him! Removing favorite activities helps but sometime he just replys with" I dont care I dont want to do that anyway"! Im just so flustered  Thanks AnneM and Lisle for your help... |
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Post by catseye on Sept 23, 2004 12:09:57 GMT -5
I do have limited experience in the behavior modifications, but I will try to list some things that help sd (notice I did NOT say work for!! LOL)....
In councelling I learned to talk about "choices", as in asking sd if such and such was a good choice or a bad choice... Allowing her input in the consequence of the bad choice, which of course her input usually gets vetoed!! ;D
Another thing, that unfortunately I have not put enought energy into, is the behavior charts... For my sd she needs visiual (actual pictures rather than words), reminders... This chart is not set up as some are, it is ultimately a reward chart... Not a discipline chart persay, no matter what happens she gets a reward, but it is inline with the behavior... Oh I am not explaining this well...
OK the word "computer" (one of sd favorite things) is written down... Each letter is worth a certain amount of minutes for computer time additional to already alloted time... Every bad choice, crosses off a letter, thus losing the few minutes the letter is worth... This allows minimal consequences, but guarantees at least a small reward, even when not necessarily earned... BTW we have not had one single day where sd did not get SOME additional time... Which I consider a good thing...
You really have to set the ground rules here, specifically for you child... Mouthy costs a letter, doing something not asked to do (ie cleaning room, brushing teeth (I really have to push hygene) etc gains a letter back that may have already been lost... Hitting or acting out, depending on the nature of the offense, can cost 2 letters (another big one I have to stress for sd)... Its situational a bit here, as in if it was "provoked", or if I feel it was due to outside factors (medication wearing off, a change in her routine etc)...
Granted you have to keep it fun, to avoid the "I didnt want to do that anyway" thing, usually I can help that by changing the word and reward once a week or so... They get bored so easily, and you have to keep their interest in the "game"...
I know time outs dont work!! They definately dont work for sd, unless I dont mind me becomming bloody and bruised from her violent temper, since you litterally would have to hold her in the time out...
Chasing also wont work for me, since I have an old injury in my ankle/foot, that simply wont accomodate a chase from me!! LOL Besides they are usually oblivious to natural consequences (such as getting hit by a car!!) it could be quite dangerous to chase them...
As far as the medication side effects of hardly eating, or sleeping... Yeah that is no fun to deal with either... For the hardly sleeping sd at one time, was on a very small dose of clonidine (.05 mg at night), which did help with that issue... The no eating I compinsate a few different ways, I feed her JUNK! Major calories basically when she does eat (I know bad mom!!)... Or we do a weekend of no medication, she eats everything in the house... I can usually keep her weight pretty even keel this way...
So what has he been diagnosed with? Is it just ADHD at this point? My sd9 has ADHD, autistic and hearing impaired (and I do suspect ODD also)...
BTW WE or YOU did not cause ODD in your son... It is not a bad parenting issue, honest!! I know because my other child is nothing like my sd, yet has been raised exactly the same way... And tell your hubby he can go jump off a bridge! LOL (KIDDING!)
I hope I helped some, or can possibly think up more help... I know how difficult this all is, been there and unfortunately still doing that! Good luck
cat
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Post by franksmom on Sept 23, 2004 13:00:00 GMT -5
Oh thanks Cat, What great input. I have to see if I can develop a chart like you spoke about. The most important part will be ME making sure Im on top of it all the time. Ya know how sometimes you have so much on your plate that your arent as consistant as you would like? Thats me! My son is 9 and is diagnosed ADHD and that is all BUT I know there is ODD in there! We have had a very rough time since Aug when school started. Mostly with school. I just had him placed in an emotional support calss with 6 other kids. Today was the first day! I know he has major trouble being in a large class of 28 and being able to focus...etc. This looks like it will work well because they use rewards and build self esteem. Something the other teachers were very successful in destroying. I hate when they humiliate a child in front of the class. They even sat him in the hallway (in full view of all who passed) for being disruptive. He was devistated! I pray today is the start of some good things and school will be fun again. Thanks for all your support and advice. I really love this forum  |
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Post by AnneM on Sept 24, 2004 12:28:08 GMT -5
GOOD GOOD LUCK Franksmom !! ... Don't forget to let us know how you get on .... and I am really pleased to read that you like the forum !! and we are pleased to see you here!!
I have always found that praise and rewards for good behaviour have worked well with my own (now 16 years old) son ... this has always worked better for us than punishment and "taking something away" for bad behaviour ... so I am very hopeful of the results with this !! ... please keep us posted!
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