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Post by Amsmom on Dec 23, 2003 21:01:45 GMT -5
Hi my friends,
Please bear with me, this is long, but I am desperate for some advice. This situation is tearing me up inside.
I've mentioned before that I'm a single mom. My ds7's father has court-ordered supervised visits because of his violent temper. In the last 2 yrs he has said that if he has to see my son supervised , he won't see him at all. He does not call either. He doesn't care that it hurts my son. The father blames me, saying if I would let him see my son alone, my son would not have to be hurt. I do not trust him, or his temper. In addition to his violent tendencies, he also does not practice good judgement in caring for my son. I have taken my son to visit him many times over the years, just so they could have a relationship, even though I can not stand the man. (I actually would prefer that my son had never known him, but my attorney told me that my son would blame me if I never let them have a relationship.) I was always polite and cordial when I took my son to visit. Now since I have not dropped the supervised visits as he wants, I am no longer welcome in his home. Since the father refuses to come visit my son in my home, then my son doesn't see him at all. I cannot understand how he does not care that he hurts my son by not even calling him, but says he's "standing his ground, even if it means hurting" my son. I have dried my son's tears more times than I care to remember over his father never calling him. He now has a Big Brother from the Big Brothers Big Sisters program. Although his brother explains that he's his brother, not his father, he has made a TREMENDOUS difference in my son's self esteem. He has almost stopped crying about his dad not calling and is feeling so much better about himself.
Now after not calling my son this whole year and seeing him only once when my son asked me to take him there,
today this "father" sends a gift card to my son for Christmas. This is going to bring up all kinds of confusing feelings for my little guy. He was just coming to terms in his own way over this "man's" extreme thoughtlessness and disregard for his feelings. I know I have to give it to him, but I am so afraid of all the feelings this will unleash. My son's therapist is out of town until Jan 5th, so we can't even go that avenue. My son is ADHD/bipolar and his feelings are felt and expressed x 1 million compared to other kids. (as many of you also experience with your kids) I know my son, when I give it to him, he will immediately forgive and forget all the pain his father has caused and say, "I want to see Daddy right now, Mommy please take me over there right now." He knows that his father won't allow me there, he said it right in front of my son. And honestly, I don't want to go to his house. Furthermore, this has happened in other ways over the years, where he stops contact with my son, my son cries and cries, then eventually he gets back in contact. My son forgives him and wants to see him again. He sees my son for a little while with my supervision and then stops all contact again. Then I have to pick up the pieces of my poor son's heart all over again. It KILLS me and I can only imagine what it does to my son.
I just don't know what to do. I so dread having to go through this again and having my son go through it even more.
I would greatly appreciate any advice and feedback.
Thank you, dear friends.
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Post by aimee30 on Dec 23, 2003 21:30:19 GMT -5
Amsmom,
I feel for you. I am in a similiar situation, although we didn't have the violence. My two oldest children have problems with seeing their dad. He makes so many promises about visiting with them, buying gifts, etc. and fails to come through. I know first hand how upsetting it can be for them. We are the ones who wipe away the tears and try the best we can to explain when something goes wrong. I know it hurts the kids but in the end it is hurting the "father's". The can be such cruel and insensitive men. There is not much advice I can give. Just letting you know that you are doing the right thing. Keep to your ground. As the kids get older hopefully they will come to understand and see that it is their "father's" that are in the wrong. I always try not to say anything in front of my kids that will disrespect their "father". I hope that one day they will see for themselves.
Stay strong. Hold to your ground and give the little one some extra hugs.
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Post by Amsmom on Dec 23, 2003 21:53:43 GMT -5
Thanks so much Aimee. I am crying as I write this, because I don't know how to handle this. I wish the @#$% gift card never came. I don't want my son to go through those horrible whirlwind of emotions that he goes through every time his "father" pops up. I have not told my son bad things about his father. Believe it or not, when my son was 5, the father told him that he abused me when I was pregnant (true, but never something a 5 yo should be told). He also told my son other very inappropriate things. I used to think I deserved an Oscar because I acted so pleasant around his father for my son's sake. In the last 2 yrs, my son has seen for himself how hurtful and dishonest his father is by the way he disappears from his life.
Thanks again Aimee. It was great to hear from you.
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Post by Linda on Dec 23, 2003 21:57:05 GMT -5
This sounds so much like my life....please know you are not alone....It Is SO painful to see our kids hurt.
Hang in there and do what is right for your little one...and believe it or not,your child will come and understand to some degree that it is mom who is holding everything together and not his so called dad.
Give your son the gift card,even if you don't want to,your ex will hold it over your head if you don't.
Just be there for your son and give extra hugs...and just know it will get better as your son matures and he will see his dad as he really is.
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Post by ohmama on Dec 23, 2003 21:57:59 GMT -5
Ams mom,
This will probably not be the average opinion but I say, don't give him the card, don't even mention it to him. The whole situation is not normal and you've been put in complete control since your ex has refused to be reasonable. He doesn't care about the boy, it's obvious. This card would do more harm than good. It only serves to satisfy the one sending it. You need to protect your son emotionally as well as physically. He is throwing him a crumb and it's up to you to intercept it. It's your call.
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Post by aimee30 on Dec 23, 2003 22:00:51 GMT -5
Any time. I cried to as I read your first post. I have cried a million times for my two oldest. It just tears them apart. Just like this week, he called. He told them he was going to pick them up on Christmas day and keep them until the 4th. We had already agreed to it. Then he calls last night and tells me that he decided he wasn't going to keep them that long. He is bringing them back this Monday. Well, guess who's left to tell them?? You guessed it. As usual Me. I get the blame for it too. Oh well. We as mother's just have to pray that our kids will truly see what kind of people their father's are. I will be thinking of you and anytime you need to talk, feel free to email me.
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Post by Dad2Brooke on Dec 23, 2003 22:05:27 GMT -5
Amsmom, I too am sorry that your son and you have to deal with this.
Is there maybe some way that you can maybe "lose" the card until after you have a chance to talk to the therapist?
Is there a chance that the father will call the son about the gift card?
Do you think there would be violence if he found out you "lost" it?
Finally, if after two years of supervised visits in which he won't participate, can you maybe petition the court to take those away?
Why do courts let such toxic parents as your ex have visits with their children anyway? They do more harm than good.
Sorry, I can't offer much advice.
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Post by Jorgy on Dec 23, 2003 22:18:05 GMT -5
I am so sorry Amsmom. I just can't understand parents that use thier kids like that. I agree with Ralph, I would hold the card and "forget" about it 'till the councelor gets back. I would love to say to throw the d*** thing away and never tell him. His father doesn't deserve him and your son doesn't deserve to be tortured by his father. Bless you for holding his world together, Sue
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Post by Amsmom on Dec 23, 2003 22:45:29 GMT -5
Dear ones,
You have no idea how much I appreciate your responses. I drank up every word, hungry to hear your advice and ideas. I am very torn about whether or not I should give the card to my son. I would love not to give it to him. There is a possibility that the father (I prefer to call him "the donor" ) will call on Christmas to see how he liked the card, even though he has not called him any other time this year. Also I need to consider what to say/do when my son asks why Daddy hasn't given him any presents this year. Last year he called (after a long period of no calls) right before Christmas to say that he had presents for him. I took my son to his house and it was a very tense visit, but I faked it for my son. There wasn't any violence, his mother-in-law was there, so he was on good behavior. Besides I had him thrown in jail before and would do it again in a heartbeat!!!! So if I withhold the card, I risk that my son will feel horrible that his father has not even acknowledged him for Christmas, but if I give it to him, I know the emotional turmoil that will follow. I just don't know what to do.
Thank you all for being there for me.
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Post by Mishamom on Dec 23, 2003 23:01:27 GMT -5
I'm so sorry to see all of this stirred up for you and your son at Christmastime. Here's my 2 cents for what it's worth...
Your ex is continuing to exert control over situations in any way he can. It sounds like this has always been his MO. First was fear and abuse, now it's withholding love and attention. While you can't do anything about that it sometimes helps to just be able to see it for what it is.
As regards the card/gift card, please take this opportunity again to be the bigger parent and be honest with your son. By hiding or denying what his father sent you will do nothing but add to your ex's ammo supply and your sons confusion. You have been and must continue to be the stable and upfront parent.
Give the card to your son and if he's happy try so very hard to be glad he felt the joy for the moment. As he grows older he will begin making his own opnions on this situation based on the behavior he sees. He really will see his father for the abusive, unreliable and disinterested person he is. He will see you as his rock and he will see that you took all the hard jobs and dealt with them with as much grace and dignity as possible.
I promise your ex will someday ask or brag about what he did and you will be the 100% bad guy in the situation. Your ex will use the story again and again in the future.
If he asks why his father is as he is then be honest if you have answers and be honest if you don't know. Sometimes it's fair to say that his father is his father but he doesn't really know how to be a 'daddy'. You wish that he were but all you can do is be a good mommy.
While this one moment in time may not become what you would like how you handle it could do a lot to pave the way for how he sees things in the future.
You are and have been doing what is best for your son. I can tell you instinct tells you this and that you're listening to it. Have faith in that. What's best for our children isn't always what they want or what they can understand. That's why they have parents to help figure out the path for them. You are not doing anything to your son and have absolutely nothing to feel responsible for - though it is understandable that you regret that the situation is as it is.
I admire your fortitude and determination with this abuser. It's so amazing that you stood up to it and continue to. My mother in law was murdered by someone she was involved in. She thought she could handle it, help him and would be able to get out before it got too bad. The day she decided it was time to get out he caught wind and beat her to death. She was also a woman who counseled women in abused situations. Even she got snagged by the charm and thought she could 'heal' an abuser. You are doing AWESOMELY!!! Don't doubt yourself or your mommy instincts. I'm so proud of you!
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Post by Dad2Brooke on Dec 23, 2003 23:08:59 GMT -5
I feel for you Amsmom, your are in the classic d**ned if you do, d**ned if you don't position.
And with a 7 yo son, he is just to young to understand, and there probably isn't a chance that you son will forget his father at Christmas.
Unfortunately, the way you've described it, he will be in pain either way. So now I am thinking, give him the card and hope for the best.
Maybe you can arrange for Big Brother to give a bigger gift, even if you actually buy it, that can overshadow "the donors" gift.
You know your ex better than anyone, could he actually be trying or is he just same old same old?
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Post by 1mom on Dec 23, 2003 23:17:40 GMT -5
wow, what a predicament. i think under the circumstances (the donor's decision to play hide & seek all year) that i would call the therapist, put the card away, and then mail the card to the therapist and let it be given there in the safe environment where the professional can handle the fall-out.
nothing is fair for your son about this deal. however, the least amount of disruption to his holiday and YOUR quality of time together should be top priority.
as for the possible phone call (which may or may not be forthcoming), put on the answer machine, turn off the ringer and turn up the Christmas music! make the most of the vacation from school and stress by celebrating it to the fullest. the unpleasantries, spiralling emotions, and negativity can all wait until the appointment.
if your ds asks where's dad, or why he hasn't called/sent gift, simply say, "i don't really know son. he loves you very much, but you'll have to ask him that the next time you talk." that way you aren't put in the position to cover for him, or dream up tales, but you've reassured him that he's a valuable person and that the responsibility for explainations are up to the donor, not you. i'm afraid that if you throw away the card, you will be at "fault" (the scapegoat) for the end of their relationship. even though you'd be doing it to save his feelings, it might do more harm than good. NO ONE wants to know that their mother/father doesn't love them and when he matures, he'll see things for himself without having been put in the position to defend dad. you're very smart to just be careful and not to say negative things about the ex. in the end, your ds will know the truth and respect you for loving him unconditionally (even though this calls for alot of generosity on your part!). good job, mom!
i hope you 2 enjoy the joys of the season!
prayers and hugs,
1mom
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Post by LitlBaa on Dec 24, 2003 3:36:13 GMT -5
It's always so hard for our kids, isn't it?
I'm dealing with a similar situation as well, without the violence. Sometimes I wish the ex would jump off a cliff or something, then there would be definite closure for DD. I agree that you shouldn't lie for him, I'm so grateful that I didn't, because then I'd have to continue to explain his unexplainable behavior.
I know it's difficult for your son now, he doesn't understand why this is happening, I wish I could tell you it gets better when they get older, but I guess DD12 isn't old enough yet because it not much better.
My prayers are with you and your son. Try to have a wonderful Christmas in spite of everything.
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Post by HooDunnit on Dec 24, 2003 12:55:07 GMT -5
Hi Amsom. It seems to me that if you give your son the card, you or your son will be tortured by it. But if you don't give your son the card, you will also be tortured by it, and perhaps your son will eventually be tortured by it as well.
I think they have done studies with rats where they've punished the rats for choosing one course of action, but then have also punished the rats if they choose a different course of action. The rats soon become anxious when they have to make any choices, for no matter what they do they are punished. Eventually the rats become apathetic and make no choices at all. They are sort of psychologically paralysed by the dilemma of their situations.
I think that I would give him the card and then begin to institute damage control. It's not a nice situation for you to be in. Only you can see it from your own position. But it seems to me that you would get the whole thing over with quicker that way.
Merry Christmas and thanks so much for being part of our community here. You are sure a wonderful person.
Barry
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Post by Amsmom on Dec 24, 2003 19:29:40 GMT -5
Wow! I am so touched by ALL of your support. Each one of you is AMAZING beyond belief. You were 200% there for me when I REALLY needed it. Thank you so much!
Today I decided that I will definitely not give my ds the gift card on Christmas. I don't want that day to be spoiled for my ds. Receiving the card will make him want to see a man who doesn't want to see him. I am sure the donor is doing this to look good. Did he forget that there are 364 other days in the year? He can't even pick up the phone those other days? He is absolutely pathologically manipulative. I am sure that he thinks this "olive branch" is going to just make every thing fine and that now I will let him see my ds unsupervised. He also sent a very overdue (and smaller than court-ordered amount) child support check with the card. I know his MO, he thinks all will be well now, and that I will forgive him. NOT!!! Once when I told him that I could not trust him with my son alone because of his violent outbursts, he told me to "just take a chance". Yeah, right, take a chance with my precious child, I think not. If he really wanted to see him, he would see him with my supervision. And there really is NO excuse for not even calling my son.
Friday the 26th will be a new day and I will decide when I will give my ds the gift card. Maybe the 26th, maybe not for days later. No hurry. If the donor never calls, maybe I'll give it to my son later and say Santa sent it late, as he forgot to leave it Christmas Eve.
I will also do as 1mom suggested and turn the phone ringer off (thanks 1).
I will be thinking of all of you. You guys are truly angels.
Love,
Ams
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